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Wednesday Sep 28, 2005

Invokedynamic

We’re looking to improve support for dynamically typed languages on the Java platform.

  Tangent : that’s dynamically typed languages - not the increasingly common horrible misnomer dynamic languages (as opposed to static languages, where nothing moves, like hieroglyphics, perhaps?).

A lot of hype has been generated over the .Net VM’s support for multiple programming languages.

Another tangent: I always refer to the .Net VM and not the the CLR. It’s a VM, such things have always been called VMs, and the only reason I can think of for giving it a different name is to confuse people. Confusing people might be useful if you wanted to convince them that you’ve invented something when you actually copied it from somebody else.

More generally, jargon has been used throughout the ages to intimidate and exclude. This is a tradition in every profession: don’t say parameterized type when you can say parametric polymorphism .  

Introducing non-standard terminology is popular in industry, as it prevents people from easily comparing your product to others, so that they aren’t tempted to defect. It’s a common trick used by many large companies throughout the history of computing. For extra credit - what’s a long, complicated term for a B-tree?

The fact is, the .Net VM provides support for all manner of statically-typed, single-inheritance imperative object-oriented languages. It could potentially host C#, or Java, or Oberon or Ada or Modula-3 just fine. In other words, you can program in whatever you want, as long as it is basically C#.

Despite the hype, languages with fundamentally different models won’t work all that well. For example, if you don’t have static type information, you cannot use the VM’s highly tuned dynamic dispatch for method calls, and end up doing your own emulation in software. This is tiresome for the implementor, and more importantly, really slow.

The JVM is not really that different. In fact, a study done by some folks at Aarhus University, part of the culture that invented object-orientation, found that there was no significant difference in difficulty between porting Beta to the JVM or the .Net VM.

So what can we really do to make dynamically typed languages easy to port, and port so they run well, to the JVM?

Last winter we had a meeting with various people who work on such languages - things like Groovy, Perl, Python/Jython.  Our conclusion was that the most practicable thing was to support dynamically typed method invocation at the byte code level.

The new byte code, invokedynamic , is coming to a JSR near  you very soon. I’m forming an expert group which I will chair (because of my deep fondness for standards, committees, meetings and process). This group will get to argue over various fine details of how this instruction should work.

Basically, it will be a lot like invokevirtual (if you don’t know what that is, either open a JVM spec and find out, or stop reading). The big difference is that the verifier won’t insist that the type of the target of the method invocation (the receiver, in Smalltalk speak) be known to support the method being invoked, or that the types of the arguments be known to match the signature of that method. Instead, these checks will be done dynamically.

There will probably be a mechanism for trapping failures (a bit like messageNotUnderstood in Smalltalk).

Does this do everything everyone wants? No, but that is not the point. It isn’t really feasible to accommodate the exact needs of a wide variety of disparate languages. Instead, one should provide a good general purpose primitive, that all these languages can build on.

Some might like the new byte code to support multiple inheritance - but each language has its own multiple inheritance rules, and supporting all of them is hopeless. In most cases, the lookup process for multiple inheritance can be benefit from this primitive.

Dynamic languages with a clean single inheritance semantics like E will be able to use this primitive directly for most calls.

Another problem is calling methods written in Java from a dynamically typed language. Static overloading makes this tedious. Languages may have varying mechanisms for dealing with this, often reminiscent of multiple dispatch. This is way too complicated to put into the VM, but the trap mechanism mentioned above should help implementors deal with that problem relatively efficiently.

All of this should eventually make it the use of dynamically typed languages on the Java platform easy, efficient and common place. That’s a good thing. I’ve long been a fan of such languages (well, not the popular ones; rather, languages like APL, Scheme, Smalltalk and Self; face it, I’m a snob and proud of it).

Why does this matter: I’m convinced these languages have a growing role to play in the practice of computing in the coming years. The extra flexibility of dynamic typing will become more and more important as software evolves.

This is not to say that static type checking is to be avoided. As I indicated in my prior posting about pluggable types, the static-vs-dynamic typechecking wars are pointless; one can eat one’s cake and have (most of it) too.   Invokedynamic is a modest, pragmatic yet very important step that helps the JVM become a hospitable environment for such cake-eating and having.

Posted at 04:30PM Sep 28, 2005 by gbracha in Java  |  Comments[92]

Comments:

[Trackback] Gilad Bracha has a very interesting post about plans to add some support to the JVM for dynamically typed languages in the form of a invokedynamic byte code. He also talks about how similiar the JVM and .NET JVM are, and the misnomer that is the R...

Posted by Panasonic Youth on September 28, 2005 at 07:33 PM PDT #

Damn! Unill very last moment I hoped invokedynamic would make into Mustang. It was hopeless to expect that because VM change is quite big, but you always look for the best. :-(

Posted by eu on September 29, 2005 at 01:14 AM PDT #

>>> Dynamic languages with a clean single inheritance semantics you mean Dynamically typed languages ?

Posted by 61.17.242.113 on September 29, 2005 at 02:16 AM PDT #

So, if the CLR is a VM, and so should be called the .Net VM, what is JVM? Is it not a VM? If so, be consistent and call it the Java VM. Or are you trying to confuse people? :-)

Posted by AnonymousCoward on September 29, 2005 at 10:27 AM PDT #

[Trackback] Gilad Bracha has blogged on plans to add a new instruction invokedynamic to the java instruction set. The new instruction will allow object methods to be called by name. Dynamically typed languages like python or ruby tend to to do method dispatch...

Posted by The Sidharth Kuruvila Blog on September 30, 2005 at 07:25 AM PDT #

i believe the term `parametric polymorphism' is older than `parametrised type'. Strachey was distinguishing `parametric' polymorphism from several other forms, including `ad hoc' polymorphism, in 1967, in the context of functions, but since the term thus existed, it was subsequently applied to the underlying type systems. i think CLU used it as well.

Posted by D. Bones on September 30, 2005 at 07:27 AM PDT #

Last time I checked Groovy was based on Ruby and far less mature.

JRuby (a ruby implementation targeting the JVM)is Ruby 1.8.2-compatible ( http://jruby.sf.net )

You guys forgot to invite Mr Yukihiro Matsumoto to this party, a little more recognition for his work would be kindly appreciated.

See proceedings of LL2 at: http://ll2.ai.mit.edu (The Ruby Programming Language)

His english may not be perfect, but the design of his language is years ahead of anything else.

Posted by vruz on September 30, 2005 at 10:16 PM PDT #

Basically, it will be a lot like <code>invokevirtual</code> [...]

Some might like the new byte code to support multiple inheritance - but each language has its own multiple inheritance rules, and supporting all of them is hopeless. In most cases, the lookup process for multiple inheritance can be benefit from this primitive.

I sincerely hope that the lookup is performed based only on the method selector, not the inheritance hierarchy. Otherwise <code>invokedynamic</code> will be useless for languages like Smalltalk and E, where selection of a method is independent of where it was inherited from.

Dynamic languages with a clean single inheritance semantics like E will be able to use this primitive directly for most calls.

E uses single delegation, not inheritance. Specifically, it uses a variant of delegation in which the parent object is fixed when the child object is constructed (unlike Self where the parent can be changed dynamically). This is more expressive than inheritance because the parent does not have to be of a statically determined class.

Posted by David Hopwood on October 01, 2005 at 09:07 AM PDT #

I think the CLR is significantly different from a VM and technically far suporior to the JVM. Does the ECMA CLR Not already support dynamic languages and languages that need tailcall support or continuations in ways java doesn't? Does code executed on it not execute a lot faster once the JIT has been completed? Oh, and isn't it an open standard. I always thought Java smelled a lot like to C+@ and is still a massive step back from smalltalk-80.

Posted by Doug Ransom on October 02, 2005 at 07:41 AM PDT #

Is this somehow related to the description in http://java.sun.com/docs/books/vmspec/2nd-edition/Java5-Instructions2.pdf, page 280-282? Does this mean, that this has been already implemented in Sun's 1.5 JVM?

Posted by sma on October 03, 2005 at 09:50 AM PDT #

as a Groovy developer there are some comments I want to say. First Groovy has some syntax in common with Ruby, but is not based on it. The core of Groovy is pure Java.
All Groovy-side method calls are redirected to a MetaClass object at the moment, which does the dispatching using the dynamic type. there is no real difference between caling a Groovy or a Java method from Groovy. Until this point no reflection is needed, but of course we need a String and a Object[] to describe the call. To actually call the method from Java we need Reflection unless we use a special dynamically created class which comes into play after the method is choosen.
To make a call this way is very flexible and allows to exchange methods in the MetaClass object during runtime. But this possibility to exchange the method gives problems with invokedynamic. If invokedynamic first calls the object's method then it is possible a method is used which has been overwritten, or maybe the MetaClass object has a more special method which should be used instead.
So you can see Groovy will not really benefit from invokedynamic. If it would be possible to extend a class with methods, then Groovy may benefit. But still it's not that easy. Vargs and autoboxing are compilerwork, nothing a dynamic language can do at that time. So method dispatching will always require special handling for autoboxing or even coercisons. invokedynamic can't do this. It's always possible it will call a method it should not call.
I think some languages will benefit from invokedynamic, but Groovy will not. But I think these languages can't have any kind of type transformation for a method call besides casts or what java allows with primitives.
Mayvbe I made a big error in may thinking somewhere here, if so please write me.

Posted by blackdrag on October 08, 2005 at 09:48 AM PDT #

Imagine that Microsoft called the CLR a VM. What is the likelihood that many Java people would say, "Hey, It's not a Java VM, Microsoft is only calling it a VM to confuse people" ? It is even plausible that the Sun legal team would have gotten involved. I think the only way Microsoft could avoid this type of criticism is to quit doing software and move into,... you know, trains... or something. Or, people could just calm down and be a bit more thoughtful.

Posted by Dino on October 18, 2005 at 10:24 PM PDT #

Sun is calling JVM JVM to confuse people. Clearly it should have been called JLR (Java Language Runtime). What's up with the MS jabbing anyway? Does Scott go around ensuring that everybody is fulfilling their MS-jabbing quota or something? Heh.

Posted by 203.117.31.241 on October 19, 2005 at 12:38 AM PDT #

Hi Gilad,

From my perspective as a researcher who has studied how to implement first-class generics with minimal changes to the JVM, I would dearly love to see future editions of the JVM support the dynamic addition of methods to classes and interfaces. It would enormously simplify the implementation of polymorphic methods. We could use essentially the same techniques in NextGen to support new polymorphic method instantiations that we use support new generic class instantiations (by dynamically loading lightweight instantiation classes).

The remarks by the Groovy developer suggest that such a feature would also simplify the implementation of dynamically typed languages.

On the subject of language generality in the .NET CLR versus the JVM, my understanding from discussions with Jim Miller and other principals involved in developing the CLR is that the CLR offers only a few features that are missing in the JVM. The only two that I recall are: (i) mandated support for tail-call optimization and (ii) an interface method naming scheme that implicitly includes the interface name as part of the method signature (so two methods with the same explicit signature in different interfaces do not collide if they are in herited by the same class). Of course .NET 2 includes explicit support for generics, but this support is specifically directed at C#. There is no explicit support in CLR for continuations.

P.S. Speaking of non-standard terminology, why doesn't the Java Language Specification use the well-understood and accepted term "receiver" instead of "target" to refer to the primary argument of a (non-static) method call?

Posted by Corky Cartwright on November 22, 2005 at 10:03 PM PST #

Hi Corky, I agree that hotswapping is immensely valuable for all kinds of reasons. I expect us to offer much more support for this in Java 7. As far as tail recursion support in .Net, I understand that using it is rather expensive, because it forces a stack crawl to compute the effective protection domain (which otherwise could be computed lazily). So it has much less real value than one might expect. Finally, of course, I would use "receiver", but the terminology used in the JLS predates my tenure, and I strive to stay consistent with it. I'm not sure that C++ ever used "receiver" either.

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